do you think Steven knew...spoliers

[Scar]

I do think that Roland's father knew Roland would kill his mother. I think that when Stephen saw what was to come he could have changed or interrupted ka, but it would be easier on Stephen to let his son kill. If it was to be, then let it be. It was meant for Roland to bear this burden, not him.

John

[wizardsrainbow]

VERY interesting debate going on here. Both sides have made good points and Turtlesong's direct quote does in fact leave the door open.

But also consider this.... Roland took his right of manhood (gunslinger) test early because of his discovery of Marten/Gabrielle, thereby weaving Roland intricately into that triangle. Steven also knew that Roland was stubborn, willful and was destined for a long, hard and lonely life. I can imagine that Steven had some foreshadowing of Gabrielle's death by Roland's own hand and a) refused to try to change ka and b) had some perverse belief that as painful as it would be to both Roland and himself to let ka proceed, the matricide would serve to toughen Roland for the long rigorous path that Steven knew Roland would travel in life.

[mia/susannah]

VERY interesting debate going on here. Both sides have made good points and Turtlesong's direct quote does in fact leave the door open.

But also consider this.... Roland took his right of manhood (gunslinger) test early because of his discovery of Marten/Gabrielle, thereby weaving Roland intricately into that triangle. Steven also knew that Roland was stubborn, willful and was destined for a long, hard and lonely life. I can imagine that Steven had some foreshadowing of Gabrielle's death by Roland's own hand and a) refused to try to change ka and b) had some perverse belief that as painful as it would be to both Roland and himself to let ka proceed, the matricide would serve to toughen Roland for the long rigorous path that Steven knew Roland would travel in life.

Very well said. That is very interesting. I never thought of it that way

[wizardsrainbow]

VERY interesting debate going on here. Both sides have made good points and Turtlesong's direct quote does in fact leave the door open.

But also consider this.... Roland took his right of manhood (gunslinger) test early because of his discovery of Marten/Gabrielle, thereby weaving Roland intricately into that triangle. Steven also knew that Roland was stubborn, willful and was destined for a long, hard and lonely life. I can imagine that Steven had some foreshadowing of Gabrielle's death by Roland's own hand and a) refused to try to change ka and b) had some perverse belief that as painful as it would be to both Roland and himself to let ka proceed, the matricide would serve to toughen Roland for the long rigorous path that Steven knew Roland would travel in life.

Very well said. That is very interesting. I never thought of it that way

Thank you. I amaze myself sometimes.

[mallory]

I do think that Roland's father knew Roland would kill his mother. I think that when Stephen saw what was to come he could have changed or interrupted ka, but it would be easier on Stephen to let his son kill. If it was to be, then let it be. It was meant for Roland to bear this burden, not him.

John

i have to agree with this..I know Stephen was a noble man, however he did go the whores bed and all .. I think he could have stopped it, being busy and all really doesnt have a voice when it comes to things such as that. After all the reason Roland was such a young Gunslinger was because of his Mother and Marten. I dont know its Ka.it was the way it was supposed to be..