So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story. I got that. (To tell you the truth first I was a bit confused and shocked and I thought the bugs were from Sister Mary's body and they ate Jenna... but yeah after I got it with sorrow in my heart.)
But it brings up so many questions.
Why?
Why did it happen? Because of the sun? Or she didn't drink blood for long? Or why? Was she simply damned because she left her ka-tet?
If the answer is clear I am sorry for my silly questions.
Anyway... what do you think about her mother? Did she try to escape as well but she couldn't survive for long she got weak so she brought her child back to the sisters?
Maybe Jenna was half human?
All the healing bugs were vampires before?
Huh, so many questions on my mind cry your pardon.
01-19-2009 02:23 AM
ManOfWesternesse
It's obviously been too long since I read this. I am answerless Letti.
Even just the...
Quote:
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story
.....surprises me now.
I'll have to re-read soon.
01-19-2009 02:33 AM
Letti
I am waiting for you eagerly here, Brian. You can see it's not a popular thread however I find Jenna's character and life very very interesting.
At the end of the story she won me so much.
01-19-2009 02:47 AM
ManOfWesternesse
I loved Jenna, as a character and as a damn hot woman! :lol:
I think my sister's still got my copy on loan, so it might be a while before I can re-read.
01-19-2009 04:13 AM
Melike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story. I got that. (To tell you the truth first I was a bit confused and shocked and I thought the bugs were from Sister Mary's body and they ate Jenna... but yeah after I got it with sorrow in my heart.)
But it brings up so many questions.
Why?
Why did it happen? Because of the sun? Or she didn't drink blood for long? Or why? Was she simply damned because she left her ka-tet?
If the answer is clear I am sorry for my silly questions.
Anyway... what do you think about her mother? Did she try to escape as well but she couldn't survive for long she got weak so she brought her child back to the sisters?
Maybe Jenna was half human?
All the healing bugs were vampires before?
Huh, so many questions on my mind cry your pardon.
Letti, I love to see you asking questions around.:huglove:You ask important questions. Let me think for answers. Because:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse
It's obviously been too long since I read this. I am answerless Letti.
Even just the...
Quote:
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story
.....surprises me now.
I'll have to re-read soon.
Same for me. I remember the ending but not the details.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
I am waiting for you eagerly here, Brian. You can see it's not a popular thread however I find Jenna's character and life very very interesting.
At the end of the story she won me so much.
For me, she won my interest at the beginning of the story.
Description of hers. The only black between all that whiteness. This impressed me a lot.
We had discussions about Susan's character. I've asked this before. What do you think about Jenna comparing to Susan?
Because Jenna is one of the reasons for me to see Susan so shallow.
01-19-2009 04:21 AM
Letti
Melike! So good to see you here. So so good. :wub:
01-19-2009 04:34 AM
Melike
Here is a sketch of one of the first artworks of me. *I know it's childish, technically weak.* Just want to say Jenna is awesome for me. I will do a painting one day.
Jenna:Attachment 887
01-19-2009 05:17 AM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story. I got that. (To tell you the truth first I was a bit confused and shocked and I thought the bugs were from Sister Mary's body and they ate Jenna... but yeah after I got it with sorrow in my heart.)
But it brings up so many questions.
Why?
Why did it happen? Because of the sun? Or she didn't drink blood for long? Or why? Was she simply damned because she left her ka-tet?
If the answer is clear I am sorry for my silly questions.
Anyway... what do you think about her mother? Did she try to escape as well but she couldn't survive for long she got weak so she brought her child back to the sisters?
Maybe Jenna was half human?
All the healing bugs were vampires before?
Huh, so many questions on my mind cry your pardon.
Letti, I love to see you asking questions around.:huglove:You ask important questions. Let me think for answers. Because:
Take your time but I cannot wait. :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse
It's obviously been too long since I read this. I am answerless Letti.
Quote:
Even just the...
Quote:
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story
.....surprises me now.
I'll have to re-read soon.
Same for me. I remember the ending but not the details.
As long as I love I won't forget that part...
Spoiler:
when Roland got up and found Jenna nowhere but the bugs. The bugs started to run all around and they formed the letter C after some hesitation. But it wasn't a letter... it was a curv. Like Jenna's hair... that's how she tried to make Roland understand the situation.
And Roland thinks how incredibly hard it must have been for those little bugs to think... (for Jenna to think) to do anything like that after the personality fell into so many tiny parts.
It touched me so much.
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
I am waiting for you eagerly here, Brian. You can see it's not a popular thread however I find Jenna's character and life very very interesting.
At the end of the story she won me so much.
For me, she won my interest at the beginning of the story.
Description of hers. The only black between all that whiteness. This impressed me a lot.
We had discussions about Susan's character. I've asked this before. What do you think about Jenna comparing to Susan?
Because Jenna is one of the reasons for me to see Susan so shallow.
She impressed me at the beginning of the story, too but at the end... I got to love her even more.
They are so so different. That's why it's hard to compare them. But I have a guess if Roland and Jenna could have spent more time together Jenna would have been able to faint Susan's perfect memories in his mind. Really.
I like Susan but she is the lovely girl from the window... and that's all. Okay, not all but she was a lovely country girl.
Jenna is full of secrets and mystery.
I see both of them valuable characters but we must admit that Jenna is deeper and more.. original. She was a real woman. Black hair... sins in the heart. A girl who was hungry for love and didn't mind losing everything for it. A woman who belonged to the world of the shadows and chose the world of light.
01-19-2009 05:28 AM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melike
Here is a sketch of one of the first artworks of me. *I know it's childish, technically weak.* Just want to say Jenna is awesome for me. I will do a painting one day.
Jenna:Attachment 887
It's not childish at all. It's good. Very good. I think it gives back her character and the story a lot.
01-19-2009 06:05 AM
ManOfWesternesse
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
...As long as I love I won't forget that part...
Spoiler:
when Roland got up and found Jenna nowhere but the bugs. The bugs started to run all around and they formed the letter C after some hesitation. But it wasn't a letter... it was a curv. Like Jenna's hair... that's how she tried to make Roland understand the situation.
And Roland thinks how incredibly hard it must have been for those little bugs to think... (for Jenna to think) to do anything like that after the personality fell into so many tiny parts.
It touched me so much.....
Ah!
I'm hungry for a re-read now!
Melike - I like the sketch - as always your sketches are so full of detail!
01-19-2009 07:39 AM
Brice
I too need to reread this. It's been a long time.
01-19-2009 07:42 AM
Letti
Yesyes. Reread you all. :)
01-19-2009 11:08 AM
Jon
LIKELY THE MOST ROMANTIC READ.
I assumed she did it to herself. Because she drank too much blood already and could not change despite her love for him. She was afraid she would be tempted to drink Roland's blood until he died. Kinda like kissing a lover to death. Kissing him and never wanting to stop!
Does that make sense? It was what I gleaned.
01-20-2009 04:29 AM
ManOfWesternesse
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
Yesyes. Reread you all. :)
To hear is to obey, O Great Mistress! :huglove:
I started a re-read last night. (I thought my sister still had my copy - but evidently she returned it!)
Only a few pages in yet. Roland is facing down the slow mutants, and topsy (what a name for a Gunslingers horse!) has just keeled over and died.
No Jenna as yet.
01-20-2009 04:57 AM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
Yesyes. Reread you all. :)
To hear is to obey, O Great Mistress! :huglove:
I started a re-read last night. (I thought my sister still had my copy - but evidently she returned it!)
Only a few pages in yet. Roland is facing down the slow mutants, and topsy (what a name for a Gunslingers horse!) has just keeled over and died.
No Jenna as yet.
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story. I got that. (To tell you the truth first I was a bit confused and shocked and I thought the bugs were from Sister Mary's body and they ate Jenna... but yeah after I got it with sorrow in my heart.)
But it brings up so many questions.
Why?
Why did it happen? Because of the sun? Or she didn't drink blood for long? Or why? Was she simply damned because she left her ka-tet?
If the answer is clear I am sorry for my silly questions.
Although these vampires prefer the night, I think it was stated that they can survive the sun. And I'm not sure Jenna was totally turned anyway, so I don't think the sun did it, at least not by itself. I think both because she left her ka-tet, and the sun if that makes sense. Leaving her ka-tet weakened her and the sun was the final stroke as it were. As for not drinking blood, I'd think that would make her less inclined to become, as it were.
Actually I don't fully understand it either. It's a strange relationship between the bugs and the nurses.
Song of Susannah and The Dark Tower spoilers:
Spoiler:
It's also odd that the rat sized grandfather fleas of the last two books are referred to at one point as 'little doctors' suggesting they're the same species as the cam-tam of this story, although the size an function seems to be very different. I wonder if the vampires in the Dixie pig were made of them too? For some reason I think not. I'm not sure that the little sisters are the same species at the others we've met.
Quote:
Anyway... what do you think about her mother? Did she try to escape as well but she couldn't survive for long she got weak so she brought her child back to the sisters?
I think that's right in a nutshell.
Quote:
Maybe Jenna was half human?
I'm not sure. I think so, or she might have been another humanoid creature altogether. She is capable of goodness though.. but then again so was Mia. I wonder why she in particular had the special bells and the power over the little doctors. You would think that the 'big sister' would have had that power. Maybe the nurses were originally true healers and the cam-tam were originally utilized for good. Maybe it takes those original people to control them, and the other nurses had gone too far over so to speak. (Nah, I'm not convinced either, the vampires and cam-tam being different incarnations of the same being and all.)
Incidentally, there is a tale at the end of one of the Dark Tower:Treachery comics (issue 3 I believe) that deals with the vampire nurses too. It adds a bit more although adds other questions too.
Quote:
All the healing bugs were vampires before?
I'm really not sure. I think so, although I don't think all vampires will become bugs... if that makes sense.
01-21-2009 01:42 AM
ManOfWesternesse
Right. Finished my re-read last night.
it's a beautiful little story this, I'd forgotten a lot of the detail.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story. I got that. (To tell you the truth first I was a bit confused and shocked and I thought the bugs were from Sister Mary's body and they ate Jenna... but yeah after I got it with sorrow in my heart.)
But it brings up so many questions.
Why?
Why did it happen? Because of the sun? Or she didn't drink blood for long? Or why? Was she simply damned because she left her ka-tet?
If the answer is clear I am sorry for my silly questions.
Anyway... what do you think about her mother? Did she try to escape as well but she couldn't survive for long she got weak so she brought her child back to the sisters?
Maybe Jenna was half human?
All the healing bugs were vampires before?
Huh, so many questions on my mind cry your pardon.
Yes, Jenna 'became' part of the bugs in the end. (Same as what she said of Coquina (sp?) after the bugs swarmed over her. She said of her to the other 3 "... she's part of their medicine now...".
I think it happened, not just because she wasn't drinking blood, and not just because of the sun (they seemed to be able to tolerate that anyway to some degree), but mainly because she no longer wanted to be a Sister. She couldn't be human - though I got a great sense she would love to be (".. will you kiss me like a man kisses a woman Roland... on the mouth..."?), but that wasn't for her kind. I think (I have no doubt) she knew what was to happen, but rejected continuing to be a Sister regardless.
Do all sisters (all vampires) turn into the bugs? - Yes, it seems likely enough - though they can live for centuries/millenia before that happens.
Was Jenna half human? I'm inclined to think not, though there's no way to know.
I think her mother ran away to try to spare Jenna the life of a Sister, but found it was impossible for either of them to survive without it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainslinger
...
Song of Susannah and The Dark Tower spoilers:
Spoiler:
It's also odd that the rat sized grandfather fleas of the last two books are referred to at one point as 'little doctors' suggesting they're the same species as the cam-tam of this story, although the size an function seems to be very different. I wonder if the vampires in the Dixie pig were made of them too? For some reason I think not. I'm not sure that the little sisters are the same species at the others we've met.
...
Yes, the same observation occured to me.
Song of Susannah and The Dark Tower spoilers:
Spoiler:
Did King just forget about the size definition he made in LSoE? (sic."...about twice the size of an ant...")
The whole "Little Doctors" thing seems to strongly indicate they are the same species.
Did he deliberatley change the size to make the whole Oy/Bumblers in general idea work? -He could hardly have made the idea of Bumblers being used to attack the bugs work if they were as small as originally stated.
As for the Sisters from LSoE and the others from SoS - in my mind they are the exact same species, have to be.
01-21-2009 03:28 AM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse
Right. Finished my re-read last night.
it's a beautiful little story this, I'd forgotten a lot of the detail.
You are quick, my friend. :wub:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
So she turned into healing bugs at the end of the story. I got that. (To tell you the truth first I was a bit confused and shocked and I thought the bugs were from Sister Mary's body and they ate Jenna... but yeah after I got it with sorrow in my heart.)
But it brings up so many questions.
Why?
Why did it happen? Because of the sun? Or she didn't drink blood for long? Or why? Was she simply damned because she left her ka-tet?
If the answer is clear I am sorry for my silly questions.
Anyway... what do you think about her mother? Did she try to escape as well but she couldn't survive for long she got weak so she brought her child back to the sisters?
Maybe Jenna was half human?
All the healing bugs were vampires before?
Huh, so many questions on my mind cry your pardon.
Yes, Jenna 'became' part of the bugs in the end. (Same as what she said of Coquina (sp?) after the bugs swarmed over her. She said of her to the other 3 "... she's part of their medicine now...".
I think it happened, not just because she wasn't drinking blood, and not just because of the sun (they seemed to be able to tolerate that anyway to some degree), but mainly because she no longer wanted to be a Sister. She couldn't be human - though I got a great sense she would love to be (".. will you kiss me like a man kisses a woman Roland... on the mouth..."?), but that wasn't for her kind. I think (I have no doubt) she knew what was to happen, but rejected continuing to be a Sister regardless.
So it was her choice as well? Could she have had more time... if she had wanted to?
I'm sorry if my questions are silyl but I fell in love with this story and your ideas are important to me.
Why didn't she say goodbye to Roland if she knew it would happen? However... I might have done the same. Saying goodbye is one of the hardest things on Earth.
Quote:
Do all sisters (all vampires) turn into the bugs? - Yes, it seems likely enough - though they can live for centuries/millenia before that happens.
And I have a guess they don't die of heart attack...
Quote:
Was Jenna half human? I'm inclined to think not, though there's no way to know.
I think her mother ran away to try to spare Jenna the life of a Sister, but found it was impossible for either of them to survive without it.
I thought that maybe she was half human because she was (or just seemed to be?) more powerful than the sisters. And I don't really understand why. There was something very special about her and I don't think that it was her age. Age makes vampires more powerful.
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainslinger
...
Song of Susannah and The Dark Tower spoilers:
Spoiler:
It's also odd that the rat sized grandfather fleas of the last two books are referred to at one point as 'little doctors' suggesting they're the same species as the cam-tam of this story, although the size an function seems to be very different. I wonder if the vampires in the Dixie pig were made of them too? For some reason I think not. I'm not sure that the little sisters are the same species at the others we've met.
...
Yes, the same observation occured to me.
Song of Susannah and The Dark Tower spoilers:
Spoiler:
Did King just forget about the size definition he made in LSoE? (sic."...about twice the size of an ant...")
The whole "Little Doctors" thing seems to strongly indicate they are the same species.
Did he deliberatley change the size to make the whole Oy/Bumblers in general idea work? -He could hardly have made the idea of Bumblers being used to attack the bugs work if they were as small as originally stated.
As for the Sisters from LSoE and the others from SoS - in my mind they are the exact same species, have to be.
All the dogs are dogs (the same species) and they can be really small and very big, too.
01-21-2009 03:50 AM
Brainslinger
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
Why didn't she say goodbye to Roland if she knew it would happen?
I don't think she did know for certain. Ironically, I think from her point of view, it was still the best thing she ever did. Even despite the consequences.
(Blargh. I've gone all romantic like...)
Quote:
I thought that maybe she was half human because she was (or just seemed to be?) more powerful than the sisters. And I don't really understand why. There was something very special about her and I don't think that it was her age. Age makes vampires more powerful.
She is more powerful in a specific way (i.e. her control over the cam-tam) but in terms of vampiric power, the sisters are far stronger. (That's how I see it.) Why it falls to her to control them I don't know, but another thought occurs to me...
Maybe the full turned vampires are just too chaotic in nature. I.e. the little system they have going requires a large degree of self control. While the cam-tam are healers they can probably be used to destroy too. If a full vampire had control of them they might just use them to lay waste feeding on the survivors at a large scale. People would become aware of them all the sooner and stake them (assuming that works on these girls.)
Having someone more 'pure of heart' in control allows them to survive longer, just keep the little doctors to their specific purpose.
Another thought occurs; maybe they require Jenna to control the cam-tam, for the cam-tam to even function as doctors. (Healing is ultimately a positive thing after all, although her it is utilized for evil.) Maybe without her they would just revert to
Spoiler:
the grandfather fleas. Bugs who just scavenge and kill.
Robin Furth's backstory
Spoiler:
seems to contradict that though. There is noone like Jenna in that tale. Considering they were discovered though, I wouldn't be surprised if I'm she (or her mother/grandmother more likely) was brought in for more control later though.
Quote:
All the dogs are dogs (the same species) and they can be really small and very big, too.
That's a good point. Also maybe the bugs change according to the function they have been given.
01-21-2009 03:53 AM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainslinger
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
Why didn't she say goodbye to Roland if she knew it would happen?
I don't think she did know for certain. Ironically, I think from her point of view, it was still the best thing she ever did. Even despite the consequences
I absolutely agree.
01-21-2009 03:55 AM
Letti
I find it really romantic and nice about Jenna and Roland's relationship that they spent such little time together. Some minutes... still they got to belong to each other so much. So hard.
01-21-2009 04:57 AM
ManOfWesternesse
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
I thought that maybe she was half human because she was (or just seemed to be?) more powerful than the sisters. And I don't really understand why. There was something very special about her and I don't think that it was her age. Age makes vampires more powerful.
She is more powerful in a specific way (i.e. her control over the cam-tam) but in terms of vampiric power, the sisters are far stronger. (That's how I see it.) Why it falls to her to control them I don't know,
Yes, the other Sisters (and big Sister in particular) were more powerful than Jenna.
The one specific in which she was more powerful, and the reason why they feared her, was that she was the wearer of the dark bells. It was the dark bells that enabled her to control the cam-tam differently than the other sisters.
QUESTION: (doesn't one always lead to another!) - how did she become the wearer of the dark bells? Where did she get them - was it from her mother? (somehow I feel that's not it.)
Quote:
So it was her choice as well? Could she have had more time... if she had wanted to?
&
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Letti
Why didn't she say goodbye to Roland if she knew it would happen?
I don't think she did know for certain. Ironically, I think from her point of view, it was still the best thing she ever did. Even despite the consequences.
&
Quote:
I find it really romantic and nice about Jenna and Roland's relationship that they spent such little time together. Some minutes... still they got to belong to each other so much. So hard.
Could she have had more time? - probably not really, or not much. Not once she'd clearly decided she couldn't live on as a Sister any more.
I think she was content in knowing Roland accepted her fully. Why not tell him all? - I guess it would be very hard to do.
Yes, it was amazing that King could give us so much in a few short words.
12-16-2009 05:12 PM
pinkymcfatfat
Question...
This has been on my mind for some time...does anyone else think the 'dark bells' might serve another purpose? Since the grandfather fleas/doctor bugs show up on multiple worlds, I've wondered if the dark bells are possibly some sort of 'todash' chimes...thoughts?
12-18-2009 02:50 PM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by pinkymcfatfat
Question...
This has been on my mind for some time...does anyone else think the 'dark bells' might serve another purpose? Since the grandfather fleas/doctor bugs show up on multiple worlds, I've wondered if the dark bells are possibly some sort of 'todash' chimes...thoughts?
Shame on me I don't remember the dark bells very well. I should reread this novel. Did the sisters wear them on their head to be able to call out the little doctors? Is that correct? What was their sound like?
12-22-2009 06:41 AM
ManOfWesternesse
Only Jenna had the "Dark Bells", not the others.
It's a fair point pinky, I'd not associated the Dark Bells and Todash Chimes before. Hmmm. No, i don't see a relationship. There's no suggestion that jenna sent the bugs to other worlds/ other times using the Bells (Unless the simple act of calling them, using the Bells, MEANS calling them FROM other worlds/times??).
Have to have ANOTHER re-read (it's already nearly a year since the one above^^).
12-24-2009 01:36 AM
Letti
Quote:
Originally Posted by ManOfWesternesse
Only Jenna had the "Dark Bells", not the others.
It's a fair point pinky, I'd not associated the Dark Bells and Todash Chimes before. Hmmm. No, i don't see a relationship. There's no suggestion that jenna sent the bugs to other worlds/ other times using the Bells (Unless the simple act of calling them, using the Bells, MEANS calling them FROM other worlds/times??).
Have to have ANOTHER re-read (it's already nearly a year since the one above^^).
Let's re-read it together. ;)
06-17-2011 04:55 PM
RolandLover
Just finished reading LSOE and of course I loved it simply because it's another story about Roland. My question is this, in the story, Roland said he looked at Jenna in a womanly way. Something he hasn't done since Susan. He wanted to make love to Jenna because it's been that long for him but he fell asleep. I haven't read the comics yet that's my next reading but i have skimmed the forums, but I thought Roland took Aileen as a lover?
06-19-2011 09:47 AM
Brainslinger
It's never stated that he never slept with anyone else since Susan, albeit they certainly didn't mean as much. The Gunslinger strongly suggests he has had plenty of women, although being on the trail I'm sure he goes long periods without.
Of course Little Sisters is set still fairly early when Roland is still a young man. I would take that passage to mean that Jenna is perhaps the woman he feels closest to in a loving romantic way since Susan.
As for Aileen, I don't think it was ever made clear as to whether they actually had a relationship of that kind. I understand that his parents wanted them to be together, and The Gunslinger states that he left a woman behind (although it doesn't state who that was). In the comics she
Spoiler:
certainly has feeling for him too, but if they ever got together in the intimate sense, it happened off-page.
Of course a lot of the Aileen stuff in the comics is probably best seen as a parallel world rather than that of the novels as she has a much larger role there than the novels would suggest.
06-19-2011 12:52 PM
RolandLover
Ok thanks! I think you right about what that passage meant as far as Jenna. According to the Towerpedia on Aileen, it said Roland took Aileen as his first lover at the Susan but then that was changed in the revised Gunslinger as a woman he parents wanted to marry. Oh well, thanks for clarifying!
